I really need some help. I have a Hayward heater that I've had for 2 years. When I first fired it up this year it didn't come on. A authorized Hayward repairman came out and said it was the pressure switch. He replaced the switch and it still wouldn't come on. He called his Hayward pump rep and realized I had the pump in front of the heater instead of behind it and wasn't getting the flow pressure needed. He still convinced me the switch was bad and charged me $200 for the call. Now, about 1.5 months later, it's acting up again. The heater runs for about 5 minutes and the burners shut off. I've run a jumper to bypass the pressure switch and it's the same problem. I have a brand new filter that I throughly cleaned the cartridge. It's as if some temperature sensor is shutting the burners down. If I turn the thermostat switch off, leave it for a few minutes and turn it on -- it starts, fires up, then the burners shut off. The fan keeps blowing, but the heat winds down. Something is heating up and shutting the burners down. It seems the people reading this forum are veteran repair guys. I'm not trying to bypass income from repair guys, but it's frustrating because the heater is only $600 and I know the next call is $200 minimum. Is there some temperature switch I can jump over and bypass to troubleshoot this? I really appreciate any advice.
i wish i could help , but i have no experience with pool heaters. we don't use them here in the South.
if you havn't had any luck in a couple of days i'll try to contact a friend of my dads, who retired from the propane service / delivery business.
he may be able to help me, but he's at the beach and they won't be back til sunday. can you get me a model #??
I have several, and always do my own repairs, but when he said the fan keeps blowing I knew it was above my expertise. None of the heaters I deal with have fans in them...
sounds like a forced air furnace.
like i said, come sunday i can get more answers, but til then I'm Guessing.
any luck on those mod. #'s???
What model Hayward is it? I assume its a H100ID1 (since you said it has a fan but I want to be sure.
Second, if it is the H100ID1, which pressue switch was replaced? There is one for the water flow to prevent the heater from firing with low water pressure and there's a pressure switch that detect the induction motor (fan) running. If it's the water pressure switch , being you jumped it and the problem wasn't resolved, it's definately not that.
Before I ramble on further, please post the pool heater model #. It should be inside the front panel of the heater.
It's an HD100IDI. I jumped the water pressure switch like you mentioned. It appears that there are 2 limiter switches that would appear to be temp limiters. The fan is a little blower fan that sits on top that throws the exhaust out the side. I'm wondering if I could jump the limiter switches?
VC-Racing : Thanks for the reply, I'd appreciate hearing from your friend in the business.
i just looked at a parts diagram.
its odd you say its been like this for 2 years, and no trouble.
according to the install diagram the heater needs to be between the pump and pool return, i can understand this, this is probably a saftey thing to prevent a chance that there may be a restriction on the incoming side reducing enough waterflow to cause a overheat.
do you have a multi-meter?
I doubt the limit switches are the problem. The heater will often start boiling the water as they trip (the heater will literally start jumping around). They won't reset themselves if the heater trips on limit. If you have a continuity tester check the terminals of each (with the heater unplugged), If the switches are showing that they're closed, they're good.
Something else to check is the air pressue switch. It's a black disk a little smaller than a hockey puck located on the top, right of the heater, near the exhaust. It will have two wires and two tubes coming off it. Sometimes the switch will get hung up and shut down the heater. If you disconnect one of the tubes at the blower and gently blow into it and gently pull the air back out, you will hear the switch open and close. By doing this it will clear out anything that may have gotten in there.
Other possibilities: Flame sensor, thermistor, Door interlock switch, ignition control module.
Reminder, all the wiring will have 120 volts AC when energized. It will bite if you don't watch what you're doing.
Check your inlet gas pressure, you need about 8 WCP (water column pressure) for a heater to run efficiently, it takes 28 WCP to = 1 PSI so we are talking about very little gas pressure. One of the most common problems with heaters is Gas line sizing gas meter sizing. Hayward has a great tech department they can walk you the consumer through the process but on of the first things they will ask is meter and gas line sizing
DO NOT PERMANITLY JUMP ANY SAFTY ON A GAS HEATER EVER.
Also another huge problem with heaters believe it or not is spider webs, little spiders make little homes inside of the gas burner orifices and block gas flow; check all the orifices for spidy webs.
Originally Posted by pool_guru
Check your inlet gas pressure, you need about 8 WCP (water column pressure) for a heater to run efficiently, it takes 28 WCP to = 1 PSI so we are talking about very little gas pressure. One of the most common problems with heaters is Gas line sizing gas meter sizing.
I was first thinking that it could be a pressue problem myself. For this particular heater, the heater can run with as little as 3 WC for both propane and natural gas. If it were a supply problem, the heater will usually go out within the first minute of operation. This heater is claimed to run upward of five minutes before it goes out.
I appreciate the replies. I do have a multi-meter. More specifics... Before the heat wave, I had the heater off for a few days. I fired it up while I had jumped the water pressure switch. It ran for 35 minutes then shut off. I turned the thermo down and it shut off. 5 minutes later I turned the heater to max. It ran for about 10 min then the burners shut off. 5 min later it ran for about 5min. This is what's making me believe something is getting progressively hotter and shutting down the burners. Again this heater worked great all last year and for about a month this year, so i'm thinking it's in the heater. How would i test the gas pressure? I will test that air pressure switch. Also -- i've got a hayward direct number for their techs. How receptive are they to talking to their consumers as opposed to their trained techs?
i've had no luck with my dads friend, i've left him a message to call me, but no joy.
the thing about dealing with a company tech is you are not a certified gas repairman, this is thier montra(?), they may not tell you anything but its worth a shot or you could pretend to be associated with XYZ gas comp, and that you have never had any pool heater repairs and that any tips would be helpful. i know its sly but hey in a pinch, i've played boss man before and got results.
The only way to test the gas pressure is with a water manometer (or similar test instrument). A water manometer measure inches water column which is a fraction of measuring pounds per square inch.
On the gas control valve (inside the front cover) there are two pressure taps, one on the left and one on the right. You would need to hook up the manometer to the taps and run the heater to get the proper readings. The tap on the left is the inlet pressure and the tap on the right is the manifold pressure. The manifold pressure can only be checked with the heater running.
These HD100ID heaters are much more difficult than most other pool heaters to diagnose. You can try calling tech support but as stated they may not talk to an end user.
Now for the disclaimer (nothing personal):
Many of the procedures discussed are not meant for the DYI'er to do. If you don't know what you're doing with gas and electric and don't feel comfortable with the required testing proccered, it recommended you seek the help of a professional to diagnose and repair. Gas and electric can bite (sometimes harder than others) if you don't know what you're doing. If you call back the Hayward rep, they shouldn't continuously charge you for call backs of the same problem. If they do, I would talk to someone higher in the ranks at the office regarding the problem.
My HD100IDI heater has worked flawlessly for the two years that i have owned it. Within the last two weeks it has started to act in the same manner as has been described here. I found this website last night and was wondering if and how rfaltin solved his problem.
I have the same problem. Was there ever a fix? Thanks for your help.
Found this thread the other night. I have a 5 year old H100ID1. Just this year I had noticed a similar problem - the burners would get turned off 5-10 minutes after the heater fired up, with just cold air blowing out the exhaust. Sometimes it ran as expected.
After looking the electrical diagram, it appears the two temperature switchs and the airflow switch feed the control board. Any interrupt on these switches appears to cause the control board to close the gas valve (drop power to it). I tested the air pressure switch by removing it and carefully blowing/sucking on it - I could hear the switch click - so I assumed that was functioning. Continuity across the temperature switches appeard to be okay - I think these are normally closed on only open on high temp.
I disconnected the gas supply and pulled the burners. The firebox had a large amount of debris - just brown/black crumbly rice sized pieces of junk. I clean that out. I also noted that the narrow piece of sheet metal on directly above the hole that burner when through was cracked - probably not good in the long run. The burners also had some debris stuck to them, blocking only a small amount of the holes. The burner was re-assembled.
Next I pulled the fan off the top... Ah ha! Looked like my heat exchanger must be leaking. There was quite a bit of corrision (blue/green) material on the fins of the water tubes. (I'll attach a photo if I can). There was also quite a bit of rusty metal along the sides. I'm guessing that the heat exchanger was so clogged up that it wasn't getting enough air flow to keep the air pressure switch happy.
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc14/mtb54703/IMG_3695.jpg
I emailed the photo to Hayward Technical Support asking if my heat exchanger was toast - they replied that it was probably on its last leg, but as long as it wasn't leaking, continue to use it.
Time for a new heater - maybe I can pick one up cheap this time of year.
Also as a note, I have always had a problem keeping my ph level up - seams I could get the alkalinity into the okay range, but the general ph would also be on the low side and I put pounds and pounds of ph increase in. Guess I'll need to try harder on the new one.
believe it or not spiders do crawl in and make webs that block the orifices..if your heater fires,,then shuts down,,sounds like something is resticting the gas flow..
you have what is refered to as a low nox , energy effecient heater , when you turn the control on calling for heat there is various factors that come into play, the thermister senses the water temperature is lower than what is called for via your thermistat, provided you have adequate pressure, your psi switch will close provided your hi limit switches are closed , the fan will come on to purge old spent gas from the heater at the same time the vent pressure switch [ for the fan ] senses that the fan is indeed running , the igniter will glow red hot the gas valve will then open and the heater will fire, after that provided the flame sensor recieves enough heat is functioning the heater should stay lit, another factor that can prematurely shut the heater down is the hi limit switches, they are not bad the water is getting too hot they are just doing there job, turn your pump off check your thermostat [ control water by-pass ] pull it out you can more often than not visually see if the thermostat is a problem, if not place it in a pan of water heat it up it should open if it wont open or opens but won't close , replace it. also look at your burners if there is a turquose blue granular substance on the burners or in the bottom of your heater enclosure, that tells you the thermostat is definitely bad, also check the bypass spring disc while your in that area , the by pass / thermostat is in the in / out header [ where the water pipes connect. also.... someone else allready mentioned be careful as to any wiring you touch as most of the wires are 28 vac but some are 120 or 240 vac depending on how your heater was connected , it only takes 1/2 of 1 amp to kill a person there is at least 15 amps going to your heater. so do check be careful.
steve
I have also had this problem with the h1001dp1 and I have bypassed ALL of the safety switches. Has anyone solved this problem.I have also cleaned the burners and orifices for gas. Does anyone know how this heater detects flame?
there is a similar thread going on this heater - take a look at that one as well.
http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=345253
the heater uses the ignitor as a flame detector. it was suggested to me that a bad ground can cause the heater to not detect the flame correctly.
My pool water is clear but small pieces are going back into pool through the return jets (I put nylon stocking at the jets and it catches the small pieces)
- I have done a sand change (including new stem pipe and laterals)
- I have replaced the sand filter dial valve.
- When I take off dial valve the water level in the filter is right up to the top of the filter.
- I think the input dirty water might be mixing with the output clean water at the connection between the stem pipe and the dial valve becuse the water is level is right over the stem pipe.
- Anyone else had this problem?
- I was wondering if the heater is partially blocked so there is very high back pressure which is causing water push-back into the filter and causing the very high water level in the filter and thus the bugs going back into the return to Pool line.
- Anybody else have had this poblem?
- Any help would be appreciated.
This is probably a stupid question, but you made sure the laterals were unfolded (in the down position) before you put the sand in, right? If you have a lateral assembly that moves on a ball and folds up, that kind of lateral assembly is a little notorious in our industry for letting sand pass where it shouldn't. I don't think it would be enough particulate to block a heat exchanger, but it could interfere with a heater's automatic bypass or pressure switch. Also, you have the sand at the appropriate level in the tank? Just making sure. If you have very high back pressure, re-check your connections to make sure the water is travelling through all the equipment in the right direction.
Originally Posted by angus4u
believe it or not spiders do crawl in and make webs that block the orifices..if your heater fires,,then shuts down,,sounds like something is resticting the gas flow..
also if heater fires and goes out thermal couple can be bad it tells main valve when to allow gas or not
Tags: pool, heater, repair, pressure switch, your heater, heat exchanger, heater will, water pressure, burners shut, dial valve, fires then, heater fires
